Use Linksys wireless router as access point?

[dparm]

Here's the deal: my parents have a Linksys WRT54G 802.11g wireless router at their house. Even with a larger antenna there is a dead spot in my brother's room; his signal strength fluctuates a lot and he frequently complains.

My question is this: if I were to buy this Linksys wireless router (http://www.linksys.com/servlet/Satellite?c=L_Product_C2&childpagename=US%2FLayout&cid=1115416825655&pagename=Linksys%2FCommon%2FVisitorWrapper), is there a way to "daisy chain" them together so this new one acts as a relay/access point? I'd like to find out now so that I don't waste money on an unnecessary piece of hardware. Some of the other Linksys wireless APs are quite pricey, but Staples has the above router on sale right now.

Thanks in advance.

[jharriso]

Could you build a cantenna and try that?

I don't think there is a way to daisy chain routers like that, since the wireless is assigned as though it were directly on the LAN, and the signal from the other router would need to be acting like with was on the WAN port.

It would probably be easier to get something like this: http://store.yahoo.com/justdeals/dwlg710re.html

[dcv]

You mean run a router into a router? That can be done, but it'd require wires (i.e. a cable from the WAN port on the new router to one of the four LAN ports on the old one). I don't think it can be done wirelessly. If all you needed was like an extra few feet, though, you could buy the new router and 20'-50' cable and place the new router 20'-50' closer to your brother's room.

I'd just go with Josh's suggestion of a range extender - it's probably the easiest thing to do.

[lnp]

I agree with the idea of the range extender, but I would say that with Apple's Airport Extreme/Airport express combo, you can easily use the airport express as a repeater to extend the wireless range. However, the placement of the express needs to be within the decent operating range of the extreme, so the gain is minimal.

I would say that in the way of range extenders, take time to think of the directionality of the antenna as well as the ability to dial down the signal. Some antennas have a very directional signal so, if you wanted to extend the range all over the place, that might not be the best choice. Also, if you're concerned about signal bleed into other properties, you're going to want to make sure that you can dial down the signal boost.

[dparm]

That was basically my question -- is it possible to turn a wireless AP/router into a range extender? It would appear that the answer is no.

I may have to figure out a way to relocate the wireless router to a more central location in our house...it might be feasible to hide it on top of the kitchen cabinets.

Thanks anyways, folks.

[Garret Picchioni]

Daniel,

My place was built in the mid 70s so our walls are nice and thick (bad for wifi in the house). My Dad's office is a deadspot for the longest time no matter what we tried. So we went out and picked up a .11G Range Expander from Linksys Link (http://www.linksys.com/servlet/Satellite?c=L_Product_C2&childpagename=US%2FLayout&cid=1130267578138&pagename=Linksys%2FCommon%2FVisitorWrapper) and it works really well, you plug it into a wall socket where the signal starts to drop but is still fairly good. Run the little setup CD or just login to the router using the IP address and bingo you're good to go. It works well, he can only download at about 3mbit though instead of the 5 that we have in the house, but it's not that big of a difference.

If you get it, one thing you must do, any computer that is going to be connecting to your network via the expander must have a static IP set in your windows network configuration, for some reason the DHCP server doesn't like assigning an IP address to any machines that are using the expander.

[jmcgon]

This article has helped a bit with my deadspots -> http://www.microsoft.com/athome/moredone/wirelesstips.mspx

[dcv]

If all else fails, give these a try ;)

http://www.freeantennas.com/projects/template/

[dparm]

We already have a high-gain antenna (Hawking 6dB).

[dcv]

Dan, it's probably too late to mention this, but I stumbled upon this on Digg - http://www.lifehacker.com/software/router/hack-attack-turn-your-60-router-into-a-600-router-178132.php

Depending on which WRT54g revision you have, you might be able to flash it with the DD-WRT Linux-based firmware and increase the power of the radio signal and range.

[dcv]

Again, way too late to mention this, but apparently the DD-WRT firmware can make the WRT54G function as a client (http://hardware.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=189586&cid=15609074, http://hardware.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=189586&cid=15609023).

EDIT: Howto - http://www.dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php?title=WDS_Linked_router_network

[dparm]

Actually the latest WRT54G firmware from Linksys flashes it to a WRT54GL (4.x firmware). I might flash to the DD-WRT firmware though just to crank up the transmit power.

[powellm]

That should also give you the option for static DHCP.

[dcv]

Actually the latest WRT54G firmware from Linksys flashes it to a WRT54GL (4.x firmware). I might flash to the DD-WRT firmware though just to crank up the transmit power.

The WRT54GL is the more expensive version of the WRT54G designed for Linux firmware, isn't it? (Hence the "L" added to the model) IIRC, The first four revisions of the WRT54G were easily flashable. However, Linksys stripped the ability to flash with Linux firmware from the v5 WRT54G (they replaced the bootloader to prevent the flashing) just so that they could sell a more expensive version, the WRT54GL with the original bootloader (and, IIRC, a bit more memory), to people wanting to use the Linux firmware. Therein lies the big difference between the 54G and the 54GL - the bootloader.

Yesterday, though, Slashdot broke this story (http://hardware.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/06/26/2121232) - one hacker replaced the new bootloader with a generic broadcom one to allow the flashing. People don't have to fork over the extra $20 for the WRT54GL anymore if they're looking at using DD-WRT to customize their network setups.

[dparm]

Yeah I saw that yesterday. Frankly I'm satisfied with this 4.x firmware, I really see no need to change it over. Sure, there are other competing 802.11 networks in range, but I'm on a totally different channel. There's virtually no crosstalk/signal loss.

I have since switched to a Linksys compact 802.11g router for my apartment though. The Netgear one I had was nothing but trouble.

[dcv]

I think I must be the (un)lucky one - I recommend Netgear routers now because I have one that's been chugging along for over a year now without issue (only once unplugged for when I moved).

I've had nothing but problems with Linksys routers (my nontechnical friends have had a variety of the WRT54Gs - purchased on recommendation from floor salesmen and Cox Cable) - I'd set them up, and they'd magically lose their encryption/SSID settings over time. Now that they own Netgears, they're happy.

It seems everybody else in the world has the exact opposite opinion - the WRT54G is pretty ubiquitous, whereas people complain about netgear products.

If they hacked up a Linux firmware for my Netgear, though, I may jump on it simply out of curiosity.

[jharriso]

I'm with Dane on rooting for Netgear actually. Most of the people I've helped during my private tech support time have been using linksys routers.

My netgear router has been running along merrily for close to two and a half years now, and I've never had a single problem.

My preference for netgear probably stems from their older products, my houshold's networks have been powered by Netgear for many years.

I was eyeing the WRT54Gs at Office Max the other day, after instant rebate, they were only $40. I want it for the hackability. Yet again, I'm with Dane, I hope they come out with hacked firmware for my netgear WGR614 v4....

[dparm]

My Netgear has been nothing but trouble. It drops the connection at randomly, completely disappearing from my list of available networks. The antenna (singular, not plural) isn't swappable. The only thing I liked was the small footprint and easy software web interface.

My parents' Linksys has been perfect. Rarely drops signal, easy to setup, upgraded antennas.

D-Link also seems to get a bad rap for whatever reason.

My next wireless purchase will be an enterprise-level AP....they're way more reliable and powerful.

[jmcgon]

When you have to buy enterprise level hardware for home use I think it is time to reconsider your options. You may find buying 500 feet of cat5 cable from Home Depot for <$50 may be the easiest and cheapest. Sure you'll have wires running along the walls, but you can get some pretty fancy cable organizers to hide it all.

Personally, I've given up on the wireless frenzy and won't be using it in my next home after graduation. I've realized the time/money I'd spend on getting wireless to work the way I want, I could probably spend less money and the same amount of time crawling in the attic pushing down cat5 cabling and adding wall plates. Never have to worry about signal strength after that.

[Unregistered]

hi so why do they say router and access point if it cant access another router when used as access point ? idont understand the idea ??

[51Offshore]

Linksys makes a repeater. This should solve the signal strength issue.

[Unregistered]

If you use a repeater, it dumps the signal to half of whatever the max was. 54Mbps to ~28, 28 to 14, etc.

[dparm]

Interesting, didn't know that -- thanks for the info.

[Unregistered]

Hey Guys,
Another sollution to the issue may be a simple little device known as a travel router. Belkin makes a wireless travel router that can be set-up as an acces point, as a router, or as a network card. The little thing is 11g and I hook up my son's PS2 and XBox 360 to it along with Other computers I bring in for LAN parties. It works pretty good and the connection speeds are not too bad concidering my sorry internet provider (I want get into that). I do like being able to move anywhere in my house and just plugging it in.
This may be an option for you.

[Unregistered]

Ok, I have a related question... I'm currently using my neighbors internet, since mine was turned off. We both have Wireless routers... My laptop has its own wireless card, and i didnt know if it was possible for me to connect to the router (wired) then use the wireless to gain signal.

So I can set the router set up outside my house, so the signal strength will be greater... and then get the internet it picks up.

[jharriso]

Ok, I have a related question... I'm currently using my neighbors internet, since mine was turned off. We both have Wireless routers... My laptop has its own wireless card, and i didnt know if it was possible for me to connect to the router (wired) then use the wireless to gain signal.

So I can set the router set up outside my house, so the signal strength will be greater... and then get the internet it picks up.

Again, you can do this with DD-WRT, or other custom firmware, but it would probably cost about the same to just buy a repeater.

[Unregistered]

I know nothing about computers, so here is my question we have a wireless linksys, we don't want anyone in town "borrowing" our internet, I feel that is wrong, but I don't know how to stop them, can anyone tell me how.?

[Unregistered]

Here is a link to a very simple way to resolve your delima. You will need to run a patch cable from an open Lan port on the original wireless router to an open lan port (NOT THE WAN PORT or internet port). Turn off DHCP in router 2 and set it's IP address to one outside the DHCP range of the first one. Here is the link:

http://www.dslreports.com/faq/11233

[Unregistered]

To setup a wireless router to access another wireless router without copper (patch cable) you would need to set up a wireless bridge and very few wireless routers are capable of this and it's complicated. Try This Link!

http://www.dslreports.com/faq/11233

[klug]

Just use WDS. You've seriously already got the absolute best supported router in the open source community, you don't need to do anything crazy with boosting signal beyond 84 mW in software (as SNR falls off with even higher power, so you end up hurting yourself)...

If you're up for it, install Tomato on the WRT54G, buy another WRT54G and do the same, and setup WDS: http://www.polarcloud.com/tomatofaq#how_do_i_use_wds

What you've described (forming a wireless mesh network where the second acts like a repeater, but intelligent at the same time, you can even connect this other mesh device/AP to ethernet) is exactly what WDS does best.

I have 3 WRT54G-TMs (the T-Mobile variant of the WRT54G has double the RAM and ROM) and use WDS myself. Works perfectly and does exactly what you want.